Bob Thiel Mentioned in Rawstory Article

The unordained, self appointed, false prophet Bob Theil, founder and leader of the Continuing Church of God has been indirectly mentioned in an article at Rawstory discussing how some have reacted to Donald Trump's victory in the Republican primaries.

Thiel is not mentioned by name in this article but links to an article of his is included in it.

Christians who claimed months ago that Donald Trump was foretold in Biblical prophecy must be feeling prescient today. ...

Another article drew parallels between Trump and events, which pointed toward an apocalyptic future. The article cites article after article about Trump, and verses of the Bible that he finds relevant. After a long, protracted presenting of both sides of the argument, eleven reasons are presented as to why Donald Trump is “apocalyptic.” As one of these eleven reasons, Trump’s statements against Apple are cited, which “suggest an environment of loss of privacy and favoring unlimited government control. This type of thing will be exploited by 666 of Revelation 13:16-18.” (Lorraine Berry, Christians can’t wait for God to punish ‘wicked’ America with Trump — and usher in the Apocalypse, Rawstory, May 5, 2016.)

The article refers to Theil as a Christian however Armstrongism has long insisted that every Christian outside of the COGs are merely false Christians and are not "true Christians." HWA redefined Christian to mean those who followed him and many in the COGs continue to redefine the term according to their advantage.

Bob Thiel Apostatizes Regarding Daniel 9:24-27

Banned by HWA has reported that Bob Thiel now says Daniel 9:24-27 refer to the European dictator who is taught to soon to lead the European Beast Power to conquer America and Britain.

Once again Thiel has changed what HWA's WCG taught.

Back in 1965 Ambassador College published an article by William Dankenbring (who now runs his own little COG cult) entitled Daniel Nine Proves Jesus is the Christ. It says Daniel 9:24-27 refers to Jesus Christ, not the European Beast leader. This is what HWA's WCG taught.

Daniel 9, the "seventy weeks prophecy," has already - for the most part - been fulfilled. History proves that Jesus Christ - and NONE OTHER - was the One who fulfilled the prophecies of Daniel 9:24-27. He is the Messiah! No one else appeared at the time mentioned, or did the things mentioned, DIED in the midst of the week, and caused the sacrifices and offerings in the temple to CEASE! ...

The prophecy given in Daniel 9:24-27 is truly one of the most amazing, startling prophecies in the entire Word of God! It gives a pinpointed, detailed explanation of the FIRST coming of Jesus Christ - even giving us the EXACT DATE HE WAS TO BEGIN His MINISTRY! It shows that after three and one-half YEARS, He was to be "CUT OFF" crucified for our sins giving His life for us, thereby causing the need for other sacrifices, given as a picture of our need for forgiveness, to CEASE.

Soon, now, Christ will RETURN to complete this amazing prophecy and finish the LAST three and one-half years. He will finish confirming the covenant of God with many, all those who accept Him and obey Him! The truth is overwhelming! How thankful we should be that God is revealing the real meaning of Bible prophecy! How thankful, that our faith is NOT merely empty superstition or "belief," but is based on the proven and tested, SURE WORD OF GOD!

Once again the unordained, self appointed false prophet Thiel has ignorantly changed what was taught by HWA's WCG and apostatized from what the false prophet of 1975 HWA taught.

Does PCG's No Contact Policy Apply to Stephen Flurry?

Way back in 2009 I read Stephen Flurry's book, Raising the Ruins, and extensively documented what I read in that book.

While reading that book I noted that Stephen Flurry stated that he had a "telephone interview" with Aaron Dean as may be seen in this previous post. 

1986: HWA rejects Meredith and chooses Joseph W. Tkach as successor. 'Privately, [HWA] also told several leaders that Rod Meredith should never be in that position [leadership]. (Tkach. Jr., Tansformed by Truth, Chapter 6)'
This assertion is also supported by Aaron Dean (UCG), a close aid to HWA at the time, as recorded by Stephen Flurry (PCG). He states that HWA said to him that Meredith must never become leader of the church, and he also says this is why HWA appointed Tkach lest Meredith should take over (Stephen Flurry, Raising the Ruins, Chapter 3). Some of my thoughts on that book may be seen elsewhere. (By the way, the book says that Dean was saying all this in a 'telephone interview', if I understand correctly. Was this before or after the No Contact rule?) Even if we assume that Tkach, Dean and Flurry are just trying to discredit him, it cannot be denied that HWA did not choose Meredith. AR42 September 1989 also discusses the succession but Mr. Trechak here seems unaware of HWA's fear of Meredith. AR52 June 1993 also states the following: 'In fact, before HWA had even died, Meredith privately made statements to the effect that he, and not Tkach, should be Armstrong's successor.'

In HWA's last days he was greatly helped by Aaron Dean who acted as his secretary. Famously HWA thanked Aaron Dean for assisting him in producing his (very badly mistaken) book, Mystery of the Ages. He is now a UCG minster.

Now it needs to be stated here that PCG members are forbidden to have contact "Laodiceans". PCG Information explains the situation. Because of the severity of the situation I shall quote at length. (Yellow highlighting is mine.)

During the time period from about 1990 through 1993 when the Philadelphia Church of God was growing, contact with Church members outside the PCG was encouraged. From about 1994 to 1997 little was said about contact with non-PCG Church members, but it gradually became generally discouraged. In 1998 Gerald Flurry stated, "You could legitimately say that over 95 percent of God's people today have been disfellowshipped!" (PN [Philadelphia News] May/June 1998 pg. 4 left col. p5)

And then in July of 2000 came a taped sermon, not by Gerald Flurry, but by another headquarters minister obviously at his direction [M. Nash, presumably Mark Nash], which explicitly defined a Laodicean as any current or former WCG member who was not a member of the Philadelphia Church of God. The sermon stated that all such individuals had "disfellowshipped themselves by their own actions," and were to be treated as such -- members who had been disfellowshipped and marked (since this was done publicly). ...

Gerald Flurry's mis-application of the disfellowshipping doctrine was printed in the July/Aug. 2004 Royal Vision, pg. 3, and made even more strict in the PGR 2005-12-10, pg. 1-2 (no doubt due to loss of members through contact with their families).

Gerald Flurry's mass disfellowshipping of the "Gerald-Flurry-defined Laodiceans" is biblically baseless. ...

While it is obvious that many in the WCG have turned away from the doctrines taught by HWA, they were by no means trying to cause division within the PCG.  They were not even in the PCG, and posed no threat whatsoever to PCG members who had already been exposed to, and rejected, their teachings.  

There were also many WCG members who still held to the doctrines taught by HWA, and were not trying to cause division within the PCG.  These certainly did not meet the criteria for being disfellowshipped / marked, as their only "crime" was not following Gerald Flurry—some because they didn't accept his claims, and others because they never heard of him or didn't read his literature.

And then there are the many groups that have left the WCG for the very reason of keeping the biblical doctrines taught by HWA.  How can Gerald Flurry say they are causing division contrary to the doctrines we have learned?  He says it is because they have rejected the government of God, but in fact what they have rejected is nothing more than Gerald Flurry's attempt to establish his own government.

There is clearly one reason and one reason only for Gerald Flurry's mass disfellowshipping – he fears exposure, the very type of exposure you are reading now in this document.  Gerald Flurry wishes to keep his followers isolated and under his control (please read the section on Mind Control).

This astoundingly draconian policy has been enforced, tearing apart numerous families and friends from each other.

Here is one example of Gerald Flurry's no contact policy being enforced, as may be seen in this letter written to Gerald Flurry. This was written in 2006.

My mother [a member of PCG, aged 88] was recently informed that she is not to communicate with either my sister or myself, presumably on the grounds that we are now under the influence of Satan and she is in danger of being influenced to leave your "church" by our persuasion, born of the devil. ... 

Let me here then move on to inform, assure you, or perhaps to attempt to persuade you, that the main purpose of my letter here is to inform you of my love for my mother.

At age 88, in her twilight years, the only concern of her four children is that she lives happily, for whatever time is left for her. She has been so happy in your organization that she has even moved 200 kilometres to be able to attend services and even struggled to the Feast of Tabernacles this year.

I understand that you believe and teach that my leaving the WCG is a result of me "waxing cold," becoming Laodicean, or "lukewarm" and that my actions are an influence of Satan the Devil. There is no doubt in my mind that any influence of Satan, is with this preposterous ruling you are enforcing, to force a very old and faithful lady into her remaining few years, with misery as her comfort instead of her church.

The idea that this may somehow have an influence on me to rejoin you instead of having your lack of Godliness confirm the reasons I left, only indicates your lack of wisdom and your inability to demonstrate discernment, by the Spirit of the Eternal and with the Mind of God.

I realise you believe your group to be the only true church and that you have all knowledge, all truth and know all things. Your big problem is, without the love of God you are a "tinkling cymbal" 1 Cor.13 (In case you've forgotten).

A fear that your members might be influenced by ex members, other churches or contrary writings, surely demonstrates a lack of confidence in the convictions of your members and the strength of your arguments. 

Why not let their belief be tested by fire, fiery debates and their faith--as my mother's has. Are your members so weak and easily influenced? Are your arguments so flawed? ...

Christ asked the disciple to take care of his mother as he was about to be sacrificed. I wonder what he will say to you, attempting to deny me of doing the same for my mother?

This attitude of hatred towards "Laodiceans" may also be seen in this letter to The Journal, written in 2001. 

[A writer in a previous issue] mentioned that the ministers of the PCG made no effort to offer condolences or even contact those in the family who weren't members of the church.

I know why they didn't. The ministers believe they are the only members in the inner court of God's spiritual temple. To them it is practically a sin to do something as simple as offer a condolence to a nonmember, especially if that person is a member of another Church of God. To them such people are nothing but nasty Laodiceans who are to be treated as though they have been marked.

I know this because an Edmond minister said this several years ago in a sermon. He said brethren in any of the other offshoot churches should be regarded as marked and disfellowshipped.

The longer I am out of the PCG, the more I see how hypocritical and arrogant it is, specifically the ministry, which rules by fear and intimidation. Yet most of the lay members are honest, decent and faithful. I hope they wake up in time to see how misled they are.

(This letter was also mentioned in the self ordained false prophet Bob Thiel's article regarding PCG.)

On December 3, 2005, Gerald Flurry made another sermon "clarifying" the no contact policy which was reported in The Journal.

Indeed, Mr. Flurry, along with several other modern-day Church of God leaders, seems to see Laodiceans as worse than abject heathens. PCG members are permitted to have friendly contact with supposed heathens--those who have never been Sabbath-keeping Christians, including members of Sunday-observant churches--but not with their fellow Church of God members whom the PCG judges to be Laodiceans.

"I want to clarify the Philadelphia Church of God's policy on contact with disfellowshipped family members," Mr. Flurry told the brethren in Edmond Dec. 3. "This issue has not been clear among all our ministers and members. We need to become more unified on it."...

"In the past," he [Gerald Flurry] said "some members" have operated under the mistaken notion that "relationships" with family members are permitted "as long as religion is not discussed." But "that is not what God says."

The Bible "makes it clear that there should be a complete cut-off" of contact with any family member, no matter how closely related, with only two exceptions. [Namely non-PCG spouse or unbaptized children. - Redfox.] ...

Although they may associate with their children as long as they were never converted, "if your children have been baptized and left [the PCG], that relationship should be severed. We must obey God's command." [These are Gerald Flurry's words.]

So we see this is a most serious matter.

Does this no contact rule apply to PCG's leaders?

Apparently not to Stephen Flurry.

I have just learned that PCG has released the notes for Stephen Flurry's book, Raising the Ruins, and it notes when Stephen Flurry interviewed Aaron Dean by telephone. Here is the relevant footnote.

Personal interview with Aaron Dean, November 22, 2005. (Footnotes, 5, 7, 14 and 28 for Chapter 3. Footnotes 1 and 23 for Chapter 4. Footnote 1 for Chapter 5.)

Clearly Stephen Flurry had contact with Aaron Dean after the PCG imposed its no contact policy.

This is five years after Nash's sermon declaring all WCG members or ex-WCG members not in PCG ("Laodiceans") are to be regarded as disfellowshipped and marked. PCG members are ordered to have no contact with these persons.

But Stephen Flurry is allowed to talk, presumably at length, with one of these "Laodiceans", Aaron Dean. He seems to have experienced no punishment at all for violating PCG's no contact policy. 

So it seems clear there are is a severe double standard here. PCG lay members are expected to shun family and friends, even their own children if necessary, in order to stay in good standing with PCG. But Stephen Flurry is allowed to have a long telephone interview with a "Laodicean" like Aaron Dean. 

It is clear that the only purpose of the no contact policy is to control PCG members so that they continue paying three tithes and extra offerings to the bank accounts of PCG minsters. The PCG ministers expect PCG lay members to sacrifice all these things but the PCG ministers indulge in contacting "Laodiceans" all they please.

The only purpose of the no contact policy is to control people. There is no good intention behind this on the part of PCG's leaders. The leaders of PCG are just trying to control people. That is the only conclusion I can reach after seeing this conduct from PCG's leaders.

Bob Thiel's Kenyan Collaborator Arrested for Shooting at Police

Like many among the ex-COG blogosphere I suspected the self ordained false prophet Bob Thiel's attempt to expand into Africa was largely an illusion and it seemed fairly likely he was getting scammed by his supposed African followers. But I certainly did not expect things to fall apart for him like this.

Banned by HWA has reported that Bob Thiel's representative in Kenya, George Obunga Otieno, has been arrested and sentenced to life in prison after attempting to shoot at police officers who were trying to arrest him on fraud related charges.

Bob Thiel's attempt to gain glory and tithe paying converts in Kenya seemed to have reached a severe and humiliating block.

Bob Thiel Glorifies HWA's Controversal Visits to World Leaders

In Bob Thiel's latest booklet he chooses to glorify HWA's visits to world leaders in order to make HWA appear to be a great man.

Herbert Armstrong also met personally with world leaders in Europe, North America, Africa, India, China, Japan, Philippines, Israel, Jordan, Egypt, and elsewhere to give a witness of the gospel to the world (cf. Matthew 24:14). (Page 85-6.)

In fact at the time it was revealed that HWA said very little concerning the doctrines of Armstrongism when he met with these world leaders. In fact, HWA was embarrassed that he was the leader of a church and he established the Ambassador International Cultural Foundation in order to obscure his role as a church leader. Here is what HWA said.

One thing has been a serious handicap, and caused me and my touring team no little embarrassment. We have had to say that we represent either Ambassador College or Worldwide Church of God. I am regarded as an Ambassador for WORLD PEACE. But if I represent a CHURCH, immediately that shouts to them RELIGION.

Also HWA did not preach the (Armstrongite) gospel to these world leaders, as was seen ina previous post.

Actually, as John Tuit argued in Chapter 3 of The Truth Shall Set You Free, HWA never dared to preach the gospel to them [Israeli officials he visited] lest he offend his Israeli hosts. What is so great about a little playground [in Jerusalem which WCG through its foundation sponsored]? Many people do stuff like that all the time. Why is tithe money going to them and not to WCG members? How is the gospel being preached to the people in Jerusalem through this playground? Notice how the plaque cited above does not even mention WCG, Tuit lamented. The people of Jerusalem using this playground would have no idea that it was a [COG] church which funded it.

HWA's visits to world leaders was a major reason why there was so much heroic resistance against HWA's authoritarian rule within WCG in the 1970s as many WCG members could not understand why WCG's tithes were being spent on courting world leaders instead of using that money to serve WCG members and spreading the teachings of Armstrongism to the rest of the world.

Bob Thiel Covers Up Abuses Within HWA's WCG

In Bob Thiel's latest booklet which claims that his small following are the only true Christians in the entire world he discusses the history of HWA's WCG while skipping over all the many issues that WCG members that caused so much trouble within WCG due to its authoritarian one man rule.

Those in his church were sometimes branded as members of a cult, and various Catholics and Protestants interfered with his ability to get the gospel out in various media. (Page 86.)

It is noteworthy that Bob Thiel never discusses why HWA's WCG was regarded as a cult by these persons. Theil never mentions the numerous false prophesies HWA and his collaborators made, particularly the claim that the Great Tribulation would begin in 1972 culminating with the return of Christ in 1975.

Theil never discusses the problems HWA's triple tithing system imposed on his followers and the various other abuses that occurred under HWA's one man rule over WCG (deaths due to HWA's medicine ban, divorce and remarriage, the fact that most of HWA's doctrines were simply taken from other sources, the fact that British Israelism is untrue, etc, etc.). This is the closest he gets to mentioning these serious issues.

Well, at least he called it "his [HWA's] church". I know Thiel will vehemently insist otherwise but for once Thiel tells the unadulterated truth, WCG was HWA's church, not the church of God as Armstrongites had been indoctrinated into believing by HWA and his collaborators. 

Bob Thiel Covers Up HWA's Teaching About Prophets

Recently Bob Thiel has released a booklet claiming that his personal following are the only true Christians in the entire world.

It is intriguing to note how Bob Thiel criticizes LCG for changing a particular doctrine regarding the future falling away and yet never acknowledges that he himself has changed church doctrine regarding the nature of New Testament Prophets. From 1953 onwards it was the teaching of HWA's WCG that Prophets under the New Testament dispensation served only to reveal the word of God by personal revelation because the Bible was not then complete (but now that it is complete Prophets of that sort are now no longer necessary). These Prophets had no administrative power according to WCG.

HWA stated that this was the case in his last book, Mystery of the Ages.

The prophets set in the foundation of the Church are those of the Old Testament, whose writings were used to form a considerable part of New Testament and gospel teaching and functioning. No prophets are mentioned as having either administrative, executive or preaching functions in the New Testament Church. (HWA, Mystery of the Ages, Chapter 6.)

(Please note, PCG has deceptively removed the highlighted section saying prophets have no administrative power in their copies of this book, because that statement contradicts their assertion that their leader is "That Prophet".)

This was the teaching of HWA's WCG from 1953 onwards. This is shown in Herman Hoeh's article, "Government in Our Church," Good News, August 1953.

Even though evangelists were next in authority under the apostles, next in spiritual order and above the evangelists are listed the prophets (I Cor. 12:28). Often in the Bible, prophet means preacher or poet. But in the New Testament history there are several instances mentioned in which prophets-both men and women-were used to foretell by special and personal revelation from God (Acts 11: 27-30; 21: 9-10). They spoke and exhorted the brethren and, if men, sometimes preached, although not usually evangelistic for the purpose of raising up churches.

Those who evangelized had authority over local churches, whereas the prophets had no government office or authority. Even in the Old Testament, where both men and women were used as prophets, none of the prophets had government authority unless they were also judges. In the New Testament, the only prophets with government authority were also apostles, evangelists, or elders (Acts 15:32; I Tim. 4:14).' (p.4).

But Bob Thiel has completely ignored this issue in this latest booklet of his. A person reading this book would have no idea that Bob Thiel has covered up this severe problem contradicting his claim to prophethood. His understanding of a prophet is completely different from that of HWA and what HWA's WCG taught from 1953 onwards until HWA's death without interruption.

Bob Thiel: "Highly Likely That [North Korea] Has Been Reached"

Banned by HWA has been discussing (here, here and here) Bob Thiel's booklet insisting that his one man following is the only continuation of true Christianity. Every other form, even that of LCG (which he followed until late 2012), is utterly damnable.

He wants your tithes.

His latest booklet is the typical Armstrongite nonsensical mixture of badly presented early church history, discredited nonsense about seven church eras, etc., all carefully designed to "prove" that only Bob Thiel's extremely small personal following are the true Christians. 

Taking a look at his booklet I could not help but notice him boasting that he has even reached North Korea with his message.

Contacts from nearly every nation on earth have been verified as viewing CCOGs websites (ccog.org, ccog.asia, ccog.in, ccog.eu, cdlidd.es, etc.) and/or cogwriter.com with the one exception of North Korea (note: because people in places like North Korea sometimes use proxy addresses, it is highly likely that nation has been reached as well). (Page 97, PDF page 99.)

Does his megalomania know no bounds? I could not help but note the false optimism in which he presents this thought. This false optimism is suffused throughout his pathetic attempt to create yet another COG splinter group.

Bob Thiel and Garner Ted Armstrong on 9/11

Bob Thiel has a reputation for constantly correcting people on many topics. He criticizes American Football, refusing to even watch it. He condemns artistic portrayals of Europa for showing women in immodest dresses. At times he can be very inappropriate about condemning what he disapproves of. The most infamous incident occurred shortly after the tragic massacre of LCG members in Brookfield, Wisconsin in 2005. He criticized some of the locals for making crosses in memory of the fallen. The cross is condemned as a pagan symbol in Armstrongism and is not used by them. Even Meredith felt compelled to distance himself from Thiel's poorly judged words.

He has been like this for a very long time. To show this point here is another incident that I cannot recall being mentioned elsewhere.

I remember when Al Qaeda's 9/11 terrorist attacks occurred Bob Thiel mentioned that Garner Ted Armstrong was in the air at the time when all planes in US airspace had to land. He was attending a reunion with fellow veterans of the Korean War. I cannot remember if he was heading there or returning home.

Bob Thiel made sure to mention that serving in the military is forbidden within Armstrongism. HWA taught against serving in the military. From what I recall he did not mention that Garner Ted Armstrong served in the military before he decided to work for HWA's group.

Serving in armed combat is no doubt a most profound experience. It is very hard for those who fought in combat to explain such things to those who never served in combat. So naturally many veterans wished to associate with fellow veterans who intuitively understand what many civilians are unable to. No doubt Garner Ted Armstrong was motivated by such perfectly natural motives in wishing to attend that Korean War veterans' reunion. No doubt he wanted to see how his follow soldiers were now and meet up with them again.

What is wrong with that? Why did Thiel feel compelled to mention HWA's prohibition on military service in this context?

Unfortunately I am under the impression that these entries are now gone and inaccessible, though not through Thiel's fault.

Bob Thiel Condemns Women's "Immodest" Dresses

The self appointed, unordained false prophet, Bob Thiel, has released yet another screed condemning supposed immorality in order to isolate and alienate his followers from mainstream society.

Western cultures['] increased acceptance of public displays of flesh.

Whether it is on television or the movies, or a sunny day, there seems to be an increased acceptance in Western societies to display more and more uncovered, and normally female, flesh. 

Is pornography harmless fun? Does the Bible teach anything about it? How are Western societies becoming more accepting of it 

It used to be the pornography was considered to be obscene and much of it was illegal.
Until at least some time in the 1970s, full frontal adult female nudity was not even allowed in the USA in what have been called “dirty magazines.”  This, for one example, had been considered as obscene. 

The USA, and much of the rest of the world, has gone beyond full nudity in pornography. From what I have read, various heterosexual, bisexual, and homosexual acts are now portrayed. And while I have never seen what used to be called a “X-rated” movie, it is my understanding that they show those type of sexual acts.

He blames pornography for helping to spread the Internet and making the Internet a part of modern life.

Sadly, pornography is growing in acceptance in the Western world at least. 

For a significant amount of time, revenues from pornography are what primarily propelled the initial growth of the internet. And while there are many additional commercial and other purposes for the internet, the pornography is still big business on the internet. The internet tends to reduce the embarrassment and personal shame some have about letting others know that they view pornography. 

Mostly, on the internet from what I hear, internet purchasers of pornography go for what is called ‘hard-core pornography’ and viewing a variety of sex acts of a wide and often perverse nature. But it is not just porn websites, “adult’ book stores, and dirty magazines that feature pornography.

Also Thiel makes sure he states how he hates how women are dressing themselves today. As is so typical in the COGs, the leaders feel bizarrely compelled to control "their" women by ordering what they can or cannot not wear.

Why are COG leaders so desperate to control women? It is disgusting behavior. They need to grow out of such madness.

The real purpose of these dictates is to isolate his followers from society so that they only associate with fellow CCOG members. It becomes harder to disregard what Bob Thiel says if most of your friends are also listening to him and doing what he says to a greater or lesser degree.

Furthermore, what was considered immoral dress in the mid-20th century is now more modest dress than many young females wear. Another trend, which is appearing in the USA as well as Europe is the trend for women’s clothing to become more and more sheer.  So sheer, that one can often look through the clothing to the skin (slips and other covering items are often missing). This is not a positive trend but is another that I wanted to mention and it is a type of pornography. ... 

The Western nations no longer seem to highly prize modesty in female apparel (though female politicians tend to remain modest in their dress).  Immodesty in dress is now mainly considered to be acceptable or simply daring, as opposed to being immoral by many. 

What is considered to be acceptable dress for public display (mainly for females) continues to the trend to show more skin, more cleavage (and more and more women have decided to have “breast enhancement” apparently for display), and more of their figures.  This is not good. And this is not just limited to television or the movies. 

For one example, America Online (AOL), on a more than weekly basis, seems to have a news item about some female celebrity who has made the news for how sexually-inappropriately she was dressed.  AOL seems to feature this to get more page views so that it can generate more advertising revenues.

Even dancing is too sexually suggestive and is accursed.

AOL, of course, is not the only organization to utilize what is probably now considered to be “soft pornography” (now considered nudity or near nudity, as opposed to “hard-core” which apparently has more to do with nudity combined with various sexual acts/positions) to get people’s attention–a highly popular “conservative” news program on Fox that I try to avoid uses sex and semi-pornography as well, as do other organizations.  Although I do not personally watch it, popular television shows like Dancing with the Stars seem to promote a type of erotic soft pornography that “respectable people” in the past would have shunned.  Yet, Dancing with the Stars has been one of the most popular television programs in the USA. 

From what I have been able to determine, because of the inappropriate actions, combined with media success of female singers such as “Lady Gaga,” Beyoncé, Miley Cyrus, and Jennifer Lopez, many female celebrities seem to think that they need to resort to taking actions somewhat closer to their levels in order to get media coverage.  Instead of this turning the media off, the media often publicizes and promotes such poor immoral behavior. 

...these females (and their promoters) believe that this is harmless entertainment that will help careers, it is not without cost...

When I heard how in olden days some religious ministers forbade dancing I thought they were crazy. I now see that Bob Thiel has joined the ranks of such people.

What an astoundingly narrow minded and pathetic view to maintain about mainstream culture.

How terrible it is that Bob Thiel seeks to isolate his followers by alienating them from the surrounding society in order to isolate them within his cult and, through the peer pressure of follow members, force them to conform to his authoritarian rule (and pay tithes to him).

Thankfully very few people will listen to his nonsensical screeds.

COG Alexa Rankings (October 2013)

I loved Gavin Rumney's old Alexa lists. Here is another list to see how popular the websites of the various COGs compare to each other.

For comparison here are other Alexa lists from June and July and August.

I have chosen not to check the rankings of quite so many COGs as before. It is too burdensome to look at so many splinter groups.

UCG: 56,226
RCG (Pack): 110,874
The Trumpet (PCG): 149,238
Grace Communion International (Tkach's WCG): 150,941
COGWriter (Thiel): 170,727
Tomorrow's World (LCG): 383,704
LCG: 374,184 (See below. LCG still seems to have more web activity than Bob Thiel.)
COGWA: 381,818
Life, Hope and Truth (COGWA): 444,240
Real Truth (RCG): 584,486
PCG: 612,013
Continuing COG (Thiel): 634,117
Vision (Hulme): 1,052,990
Plain Truth Ministries (Albrecht): 1,435,137
Triumph Prophetic Ministries (Dankenbring): 1,690,715
Shining Light (Malm): 2,049,385
COG International: 2,209,458
CCG (Wade Cox): 2,460,918
Intercontinental COG: 2,677,031
The-End.com (Weinland): 4,485,229
Cogl.org (LCG): 5,419,663
RonaldWeinland.com: 10,925,350
COG-PKG (Weinland): 24,224,507

UCG remains unassailably ascendant. A COG that decided to change their method of government to a somewhat more democratic way, as Bob Thiel often liked to say, continues to be the main COG. Despite the constant scheming, criticism and plotting against them by Flurry, Pack, Thiel, Malm and others, UCG remains ascendant. King of the COG world.

Dave Pack was wrong. The COGs are still very much active. He predicted they would be destroyed by August 30, 2013. RCG is still well behind UCG, LCG, COGWA and PCG in terms of members. We know there has been no great migration to RCG. Dave Pack would certainly tell us at great length if such was the case. Also RCG's web site has remained static.

Here is the recent timeline of Alexa rankings for Dave Pack's websites:

RCG:
June         87,220
July          105,715
August     115,494
(August 30, 2013, Pack's prophesied reunification does not happen.)
October  110,874

There was certainly no great expansion within RCG as Pack insisted would happen by August 30, 2013. 

The decline for Real Truth's web site is particularly noticeable.

Real Truth:
June        448,357
July         435,144
August    456,355
(August 30, 2013, Pack's prophesied reunification does not happen.)
October  584,486

These figures indicate that in the build up to Pack's falsely prophesied reunification due August 30, 2013, there was an increase in web activity but after the prophetic failure activity has gone down on Real Truth's website, while RCG has remained stable but certainly shows no indication of any great reunification happening.

Ronald Weinland's imprisonment for tax evasion has been a disaster for his cult group. Hardly anyone is reading his stuff. Most dramatically RonaldWeinland.com fell from 2,571,463 in August to 10,925,350 at present.

LCG's websites have gone down. Tomorrow's World is down from 221,574 in August to 383,704 now. LCG is down from 289,043 in August to 374,184 at present.

LCG in all probability still has more web activity then Bob Thiel, despite what the list seems to show. If you add Tomorrow's World and LCG's websites together there is probably still more web activity for Meredith's cult then Thiel's. I do not know how one could combine the statistics for those two websites together and then compare them to Thiel's websites, but it seems most likely that more people are still reading LCG's writings then those of Thiel. There is no evidence of any great massive membership growth within Bob Thiel's little personality cult.

James Malm's blog has gone down from 1,217,186 in August to 2,049,385 today. Perhaps some followers of his are starting to realize that Malm is not worth their attention and moving on elsewhere.

PCG's Trumpet has come down from 108,171 in August to 149,238, falling behind RCG. A far cry from the supposed destruction PCG was supposed to face by August 30, 2013.

Web statistics do not tell everything. For instance the most viewed website for any political party in Britain is a certain far right, racist party that is not even present in Parliament. Just because people are reading your stuff it does not necessarily mean they are going to join or pay tithes.

Bob Thiel Preying on Third World COG Members

I saw this post from the self-appointed, false prophet Bob Thiel, from this thread of his.

09/17/13 p.m. The Continuing Church of God (CCOG) now has its Statement of Beliefs in the language of Swahili/Kiswahili on the internet (here is the link: KATIKA LUGHA YA KISWAHILI). This was translated by people in Kenya.

Well, after he viewed it, I received the following email from a CCOG supporter in Tanzania:

Greetings. The Statements of Belief in Kiswahili is a wonderful milestone to the people of East Africa. I do not recall any literary work of the COG that was done in this language by any group that came from WCG! This is one of the reason that made me to leave LCG when they kept ignoring my plea to do everything possible to help those brethren who couldn't understand English, who had been accepted into the church!

We in the Continuing Church of God are committed to reaching people of all nations and as many languages as we can.

Bob Thiel has also produced writings in Spanish, Chinese and Tagalog.

It is very sad that Bob Thiel is seeking to spread his blend of the nonsensical heresies of HWA upon third world people in order to get three tithes and offerings from them. Many of these people do not know English and so will be less likely to access critical information regarding HWA and his teachings and so fall into Bob Thiel's web of deception. 

The Pompous Narcissism of Bob Thiel

Recently I saw this posting from Banned by HWA which shows the sad narcissistic delusion Bob Thiel has thrown himself into. The highlighted portion shows quite clearly the dangerous delusion Bob Thiel is now in.

In my case, in November/December 2011, I prayed that if I truly had a prophetic role from God that He would have something happen during a planned mid-December 2011 trip to Charlotte, North Carolina to confirm it or deny it if that were His will. As it turned out, on 12/15/2011 hands were laid upon me in Charlotte by ordained minister Gaylyn Bonjour. He prayed that I would be granted a “double-portion” of God’s Holy Spirit. He told me that he had not ever done this before but he felt that it was reminiscent of the time that the prophetic and ecclesiastical leadership mantle passed from the Prophet Elijah to Elisha (2 Kings 2:9-13). This minister had been unaware that I had prayed that God would have me anointed or somehow identified for a prophetic role on that mid-December 2011 trip if that were His plan for me and I had never discussed my possible prophetic role with him prior to this anointing. This 12/15/11 anointing appears to be the first biblically-appropriate prophetic anointing in the Church of God in many decades, if not many multiple centuries. And the legitimacy of this anointing has been proven by subsequent events–though many do not seem to understand how God works at times. And yes, I will add that I believe that I do have the appropriate prophetic fruits that Jesus discussed (Matthew 7:15-20) and that those truly interested in the truth can see this if they truly wish to prayfully look into this.

What astounding pomposity.

HWA condemned anyone claiming prophetic authority without being ordained by a minister from HWA's group.

Now suppose God did NOT have these various officers ordained by the hand of man. What would happen? One man in New York [or maybe California?] would APPOINT HIMSELF, and come up and say, "I claim equal office and authority with those ordained from Pasadena. I wasn't ordained by the hand of man, but direct by the hand of God."...

And then this man carries on his own independent work. [Like the Continuing Church of God.] Such a work CANNOT be a PART of the work of GOD'S TRUE CHURCH, for the simple reason that sooner or later it will start pulling off in an opposite direction -- unless there is DIRECTION from Christ on down, in ONE CHURCH ORDER OF GOVERNMENT...

So you see, Brethren, WHY God always ordains men to office THRU HIS OWN CHURCH, THRU HIS OWN ESTABLISHED ORDER...! ... Any such claims to ordination or office are WITHOUT A SHRED OF SCRIPTURAL AUTHORITY! (Source.)

Bob Thiel conveniently ignored this teaching of HWA's. Bob Thiel contradicts HWA on this matter.

Bob Thiel loves to criticize Dave Pack for the pompous statements he makes. Here is Dave Pack claiming his prophesied reunification of the COGs on August 30, 2013, was prophesied 3000 years previously in some of the Psalms.

3) Also related, if God waited 2,500 years to reveal the prophecy’s meaning (3,000 years when various related much older Psalms are considered), is not His waiting done? Does His revealing it not signal that He has reached the time to fulfill it rather than having reached a point one, two or three years out? (Dave Pack, as quoted on Banned by HWA.)

How is Bob Thiel's own claim to authority any different from Dave Pack's boasting?

There is no difference. Bob Thiel is just as pompous and deluded as Dave Pack. 

COG Alexa Rankings (August 2013): Dave Pack is Down, so is Weinland

Here is the latest Alexa rankings for various COG websites.

UCG: 53,212
Philadelphia Trumpet (PCG): 108,171
RCG: 115,494
CGI/WCG (Tkach): 180,125
Tomorrow's World (LCG): 221,574
Cogwriter.com (Bob Thiel): 254,811
LCG: 289,043
CGG: 297,561
Real Truth (RCG): 456,355
Cogwa: 459,539
PCG: 474,649
Life, Hope and Truth (Cogwa): 568,546
COG-AIC (Hulme): 961,873
CCOG (Bob Thiel): 988,725
Herbert-Armstrong.org (Don Tiger): 1,184,914
Shining Light (James Malm): 1,217,186
CGI: 1,262,806
Plain Truth Ministries: 1,387,565
Triumph Prophetic Ministries: 1,596,464
CBCG (Fred Coulter): 1,721,171
Banned by HWA: 1,909,673
Cogl.org (LCG): 2,369,667
RonaldWeinland.com (Weinland): 2,571,463
COG Faithful Flock: 2,589,573
Hold Fast to All Things: 2,886,795
COG Seventh Day: 3,331,291
The Journal: 3,438,877
Intercontinental COG: 3,083,017
CEM (Ron Dart): 3,112,823
Kubik.org (UCG): 3,614,706
TheEnd.com (Weinland): 3,706,064
Foundation Institute (Cogwa): 4,866,520
COG the Eternal: 6,148,762
COG-PKG (Weinland): 6,529,070
Faithful COG in Laodicea: 11,640,910
CGOM: 12,156,111
Biblical Truth (Weinland): 19,721,535
COGAIC.org (Hulme): 22,313,502

Dave Pack's websites have dropped their Alexa ranking since last month. Both RCG.org and the RealTruth.com have stayed in their previous positions and have actually dropped in Alexa ranking.

RCG.org was 105,715 last month, now it is 115,494.

RealTruth.com was 435,144 last month, now it is 456,355.

One would think that if the COGs were about to be reunified under the rule of Dave Pack there would be a surge of activity. However, as everyone outside of Pack's information bubble expected, this has not happened. 

Also notable is how Ronald Weinland's websites have plummeted since last month.

TheEnd.com was 830,376 last month, now it is 3,706,064.

RonaldWeinland.com was 1,047,506 last month, now it is 2,571,463.

COG-PKG.org was 2,137,763 last month, now it is 6,529,070.

It would appear many have been drifting away from him now that he is less able to control them. I wish these brave and courageous defectors well. 

Bob Thiel the Deceiver Deceived by a Kenyan

Because I was previously deceived by him, I was very amused to see this post from Banned by HWA. (He cites this post by the notorious legalist James Malm.)

It appears that George Otieno, Bob Thiel's deacon in Kenya, is conning him by feigning to be a follower of his.

At the same time Otieno is also affiliated with another COG group, the Church of God in Truth, which is led by James Russell, founded February 1993, and is based in Kimberling, Montana. They seem to be a calendar group, convinced that HWA observed the annual Sabbaths at incorrect times.

Bob Thiel was not aware of Otieno's affiliation until August 20.

Even better, it appears James Malm personally warned Thiel about Otieno but the unordained, self appointed false prophet Bob Thiel ignored him

I personally warned Bob about the situation in Kenya when he first announced his Kenya followers, it appears that he is now understanding the situation in Kenya.

Clearly the possibility of having a cult following in Kenya made him ignore the possible risks and made a decision that he probably now regrets.

Will this experience make Bob Thiel begin to better understand the pain HWA and his imitators have inflicted upon disillusioned former followers?

Alas, I strongly doubt that. The lure of tithe money will most likely make him ignore this lesson.

Regarding Bob Thiel's Article On Dave Pack

Banned by HWA has a post about the unordained, self appointed false prophet Bob Thiel's article regarding Dave Pack and the Restored Church of God. That article or a related version of it, has been on his web site for as long as I have been aware of Bob Thiel's web site. In fact that article was how I first heard about Dave Pack and the Restored Church of God.

Bob Thiel Condemns Europa for Wearing an Immodest Dress

The unordained, self appointed false prophet Bob Thiel once wrote an article about the Greek myth of Europa, after whom Europe is named after, and linking this with the future European Empire HWA taught would later rise up and destroy the US and the UK.

He called the clothing Europa is often portrayed in as "immodest".

It may be of interest to note that in the European Union, there are many depictions of the woman Europa riding a beast. There is, for example, a 20th Century sculpture in front of the Council of Ministers Office in Brussels, Belgium of an immodest female Europa on a beast. Actually, all the modern pictures of Europa on a beast that I have seen seem to be that of a non-modest woman. ...

Is it only a coincidence that the symbol of Europe is an immodest woman riding a beast?

How pathetic!

Who would bother to classify the sort of clothing she is portrayed as wearing as "immodest"?

Why does he feel he needs to slut shame her in such a way?

It is only just occurred to me that it is odd to talk about that. It is. This is odd and demonstrates the rigid mindset he has inculcated into himself as a result of the Armstrongist religion he has long lived in.

COG Alexa Rankings (July 2013)

Here a new list of COG rankings.

UCG: 50,164
Philadelphia Trumpet (PCG): 89,076
RCG: 105,715
CGI/WCG (Tkach): 167,879
Tomorrow's World (LCG): 183,671
CGG: 263,048
Cogwriter.com (Bob Thiel): 309,685
LCG: 345,168
Real Truth (RCG): 435,144
PCG: 476,471
Life, Hope and Truth (Cogawa): 757,846
Cogawa: 762,263
TheEnd.com (Weinland): 830,376
COG-AIC (Hulme): 996,700
Shining Light (James Malm): 1,013,677
RonaldWeinland.com (Weinland): 1,047,506
CGI: 1,068,661
Herbert-Armstrong.org (Don Tiger): 1,087,933
Triumph Prophetic Ministries: 1,386,422
CBCG (Fred Coulter): 1,388,785
Hold Fast to All Things: 1,400,159
CEG: 1,558,095
Plain Truth Ministries: 1,585,894
COG Seventh Day: 1,762,403
Cogl.org (LCG): 1,903,097
COG-PKG (Weinland): 2,137,763
CCOG (Bob Thiel): 2,204,916
The Journal: 2,447,386
COG the Eternal: 3,062,178
Intercontinental COG: 3,213,028
CEM (Ron Dart): 3,255,385
COG Faithful Flock: 3,515,584
Enduring COG: 3,940,206
Kubik.org (UCG): 4,713,665
Foundation Institute (Cogawa): 6,057,422
FOI (Cogawa): 11,673,264
COGAIC.org (Hulme): 13,585,983
Faithful COG: 15,480,038
Biblical Truth (Weinland): 18,706,077
CGOM: 24,003,573

Compared with last month there's no sign of any great burst of activity in Dave Pack's RCG in anticipation of the reunification Pack has declared will happen August 30, 2013. Actually it has gone down from 87,220 to 105,715.

Also LCG.org has now overtaken Dave Pack's Real Truth website.

There's no sign anything astounding will happen at RCG on August 30, 2013.

The unordained, self appointed false prophet Bob Thiel has fallen behind John Ritenbaugh's Church of the Great God.

HWA Denounces Bob Thiel's Claim to be Magically Ordained by God

Bob Thiel got disgruntled at LCG and decided to leave and set up his own COG cult, this time centered around himself.

HWA would have denounced this claim by Bob Thiel. Notice what he wrote in the article 'Must God's Ministers be Ordained by the Hand of Man?', published in the January 1960 Good News.

That ONE BODY of Christ, carrying on HIS WORK, must function as a UNIT. It must work in harmony and unity, with teamwork, for God is not the author of confusion. There must be no pulling off in different directions by different men IN that one Body. There must be no competition, or division....

In order that this ONENESS -- this UNITY of purpose and action -- this HARMONY and co-operative teamwork, be maintained and preserved in GOD'S WORK, God has ordained GOVERNMENT IN HIS CHURCH. And He has empowered His Church with DIVINE AUTHORITY.
That government in God's Church is government from God, thru Christ, thru apostles, thru evangelists, thru pastors, thru other elders, IN THAT ORDER!

Pay attention, Bob Thiel, to these following words of HWA's:

Now suppose God did NOT have these various officers ordained by the hand of man. What would happen? One man in New York [or maybe California?] would APPOINT HIMSELF, and come up and say, "I claim equal office and authority with those ordained from Pasadena. I wasn't ordained by the hand of man, but direct by the hand of God." 

What a familiar situation.

And then this man carries on his own independent work. [Like the Continuing Church of God.] Such a work CANNOT be a PART of the work of GOD'S TRUE CHURCH, for the simple reason that sooner or later it will start pulling off in an opposite direction -- unless there is DIRECTION from Christ on down, in ONE CHURCH ORDER OF GOVERNMENT...

So you see, Brethren, WHY God always ordains men to office THRU HIS OWN CHURCH, THRU HIS OWN ESTABLISHED ORDER...! ... Any such claims to ordination or office are WITHOUT A SHRED OF SCRIPTURAL AUTHORITY!

So according to HWA, Bob Thiel has absolutely no authority to lead anyone.

Bob Thiel was never ordained as a minister by an Armstrongite church. He got around this problem by claiming that when LCG minister Gaylen Bonjour gave him an anointing to ask for God's blessing he said a few words that Bob Thiel interpreted as a sign that God had ordained him a prophet.

He ignores the fact that HWA taught that New Testament Prophets had no administrative authority but only directly related the words of God through visions and that there is now no need for such things because we now have the Bible.

All those working with Bob Thiel, in the USA, New Zealand, Kenya and anywhere else are openly defying what HWA taught that

• ministers must be ordained by ministers belonging to "God's Church". 

• and New Testament Prophets have no administrative authority over church members.

According to HWA, Bob Thiel has no right to claim the three tithes and offerings that he expects of his followers within the Continuing Church of God.

LCG's 20th Anniversary Celebration: Prelude to LCG's Crises

On pages 20-21 of theMarch-April 2013 Living Church News is an article by Jim Meredith detailing the celebration LCG HQ held for the 20th anniversary of the founding of the Global Church of God.

It is unjust that the man who enforced Herbert W. Armstrong's divorce and remarriage doctrine, causing the unnecessary termination of many marriages and the destruction of many families, who had eye surgery to save his eyesight while followers were told to avoid doctors or else they might be cast out into nuclear World War III and the lake of fire, who spread many false fear inducing prophesies (that Christ will return in 1975, etc.) and exploited people's fear by getting their three tithes and offerings. That is how Meredith gets his money.

It is not right that a man who has caused so much trouble for what Armstrongites call "God's Church" should be honored and adored in such a manner.

One good thing that self-ordained false prophet Bob Thiel's departure from LCG did was to mar this day for Meredith and his collaborators at LCG HQ. They would not have welcomed his temper tantrum, especially at a time like that.

However since this anniversary celebration LCG seems to also be in a financial crisis caused by LCG members not sending in as much money as LCG HQ anticipated. Maybe seeing Richard Ames hand over that "Baccarat crystal eagle" to Meredith made LCG members realize they did not need to send in so much money to them. LCG HQ has even cruelly disfellowshiped Thomas Baca II, an employee in their TV department. One LCG minister, Rod Reynolds, has resigned. 

Things are far from ideal within LCG, despite what their propaganda tries to tell LCG members.